Sabotage QA Thread

I thought on starting this thread so we have a place to gather most of the community questions about the new mode. I thought it would help to have most of it in the same place for the devs to answer and since the devs are gonna stream it later the questions presented here could be answered during the stream too.


Questions Answered so far:

Q: What about chests? Do we get chests by playing it? Trap cards, and skulls?
A: The XP quest will be replaced by a new Sabotage quest.  Sabotage will only grant cards through quests, but you will always earn skulls and xp.

Q: Will we have a custom mode so player can play specifically against friends, and maybe ad custom rules?
A: Not at launch.  Good idea though!

Q: WHEN?!
A: "ORCS MUST DIE! UNCHAINED will release commercially on April 19, 2017 on OrcsMustDie.com and Steam. This free-to-play commercial release features the classic OMD gameplay players have come to love, and also heralds the return of head-to-head OMD gameplay in the form of Sabotage, a brand new 3v3 party game mode."

Q: Will there be ways to regular progress via Sabotage?
A: There will be Achievements and a Daily Quest that will give regular progression Chests

Q: How matches are balanced?
A: Matches will be balanced via different variables. Player level will be an important one, probably also some kind of MMR or similar. If queueing with different level friends, minions will be of the average lvl of the party. Minion level will be independent for each team, so Each Team will face minions of their Own average lvl.

Q: Is regular progression used in Sabotage?
A: Yes, all your inventory will be the same for Survival and Sabotage.

Q: What will be the rewards of Sabotage matches?
A: They will reward Skulls, XP and a Winner/Loser Consumable Chest/Bundle.

Q: Will Special consumables be in the Store?
A: No. That would be P2W

Q: Regular consumables will drop from Sabotage Consumable Chests?
A: Not sure on this one but from what I understood, no.

Q: Regular consumables will still be able to be bought from the Store?
A: Yes, it might look P2W but the amount of consumables is high so it's very diluted imho.

Q: How will Consumables be chosen?
A: You will be able to choose 1 consumable/spell and 1 minion card at the start of each wave from 3 different options each. Those different options will come from the content of your inventory, randomly selected. 

Q: Are Mercenaries and Bosses eligibles as Minions?
A: Yes, but they will also need an amount of coins to be summoned. Bosses will be unique cards and cost 1000 coins while Mercs will be a card spawning a random merc and will cost 750 coins.

Q: What are the match sizes?
A: It will be most of the times 3v3 since it will be via matchmaking only (for now). I guess 2v2 can happen in case that not many people is queueing just as survival atm.

Q: What maps or difficulties will be played?
A: There will be 3 maps for Apprentice and 2 more will be added per difficulty , adjusted. So WM will have 5 different maps, Master 7 and RL 9. Waves will also vary on the difficulty played. The difficulty played will depend on the Average lvl of the team. Both teams will play the same map and difficulty.

Q: Will guardians be available in Sabotage mode?
A: Yes, as you can see in the video, there are guardian spots and they are able to be placed.

Q: Will there be ranked seasons?
A: I'm pretty sure that no. This new mode aims to be mildly competitive, not an esport. Although if a lot of people would start playing it and ask for competitive mode or for making a ranked queue for it, devs would have to think about it :P 

Q: Will there be anything done to consumables that you own an overly excessive amount of? Possible a different tab in the Premium Shoppe to trade in some consumables for skulls?
A: Nope

Q: Will minions kills counts toward the quests in sabotage?
A: Yes

Q: Are Sabotage consumables unlimited?
A: Not all. There are some that are the "basic" like starter ones, that have unlimited uses. Others that are acquired can be used once per card obtained.

Q: About the minions and waves...  Are the default minions that comes every wave and the Minions cast by the players just blend into them or All Minions that come each wave are minions cast?
A: They just "blend", they are addition to the waves.

Q: Can I start updating stuff on my website towards fixed values and informations from game? Or each next patch will continue in changing whole game mechanics, balancing, values and timing of everything?
A: Release doesn't mean that changes or patches are gonna stop, balance will be a constant change. However I would expect no big overhauls or total system changes, so I would and I will go for content creation from now on with a quite safe bet.

Q: Sabotage will reward specifically ONLY sabotage cards?

Yes. Except the XP daily quest is replaced with a Sabotage daily quest for a chest. That chest is a Survival chest for your current bucket.

Q: At maps that have more than one gate, Does cast minions come from random gates or players have to choose where they are gonna come from?

A: Sabotage minions summoned by players spawn from any door that is or has been open. So once a door is opened the first time, it's free to spawn summoned minions. Players don't choose which door they come from.

Questions Not answered yet:

Q: How will the controller setup work?
Although @Hypovolemic have something in mind it is not officially answered.

Q: If new trap, guardians or gears are added in the future how players that played every hero and maps are gonna be able to get those stuff, by playing sabotage?

Q: How is a commercial release is gonna affect the game? By that I mean what is gonna be different with the end of Beta and the beginning of the commercial release?

Q: New Achievements with Sabotage?



Post edited by SenatorBird on
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Comments

  • I know the answer for 3: Soon (tm) ;)
  • Hey, I'll bring up some questions here later, but I thought they stated on the blog it was coming on April 19th with the commercial release?

    "ORCS MUST DIE! UNCHAINED will release commercially on April 19, 2017 on OrcsMustDie.com and Steam. This free-to-play commercial release features the classic OMD gameplay players have come to love, and also heralds the return of head-to-head OMD gameplay in the form of Sabotage, a brand new 3v3 party game mode."

    From: https://orcsmustdie.com/#!/en/blog/launch-date-sabotage
  • I thought on starting this thread so we have a place to gather most of the community questions about the new mode. I thought it would help to have most of it in the same place for the devs to answer and since the devs are gonna stream it later the questions presented here could be answered during the stream too.

    My questions so far are:

    1- What about chests? Do we get chests by playing it? Trap cards, and skulls?

    2 - Will we have a custom mode so player can play specifically against friends, and maybe ad custom rules?

    3 - WHEN?!
    1.) The XP quest will be replaced by a new Sabotage quest.  Sabotage will only grant cards through quests, but you will always earn skulls and xp.

    2.) Not at launch.  Good idea though!

    3.) April 19th!
    Doug Houserman
    Robot Entertainment | Lead Balance Designer
  • Will there be anything done to consumables that you own an overly excessive amount of? Possible a different tab in the Premium Shoppe to trade in some consumables for skulls?
  • How will the controller setup work?

    Since at the moment all the buttons are taken up. I don't even have a button for loadout. How are all the other buttons work?
    I imagine this would also be a problem with PS4 as well.
  • Ty all for the answers to my questions and the additional info. I haven't check the blog by the time I asked the date :D good to know it, although I was really hoping it to be next week I am really excited to try the new mode when it comes out. More questions coming soon.
  • How will the controller setup work?

    Since at the moment all the buttons are taken up. I don't even have a button for loadout. How are all the other buttons work?
    I imagine this would also be a problem with PS4 as well.
    I'll post something later, but with some config file hacks we should be able to get everything to fit, though it might be a little more awkward than I'd like.  The exception being navigation of the Tab menu to use the new tactical screen. From the video, it didn't look like you could navigate that with the controller. But...they weren't using a controller. We'll see. I'll write up a guide after the patch if it's still necessary.
  • edited April 6
    more:

    - Will guardians be available in Sabotage mode?
    -Will minions and traps kills counts toward the quests in sabotage?
    - Will guild points come back?
  • Will there be ranked seasons?
  • edited April 7
    @SenatorBird @Piplup @Huskey

    Q: Will guardians be available in Sabotage mode?
    A: Yes, as you can see in the video, there are guardian spots and they are able to be placed.

    Q: WIll guild points comeback?
    A: Guild points have never left. They are just not considered in any classification atm. But I don't know if they will be relevant again.

    Q: Will there be ranked seasons?
    A: I'm pretty sure that no. This new mode aims to be mildly competitive, not an esport. Although if a lot of people would start playing it and ask for competitive mode or for making a ranked queue for it, devs would have to think about it :P 

    Q: Will there be anything done to consumables that you own an overly excessive amount of? Possible a different tab in the Premium Shoppe to trade in some consumables for skulls?
    A: Nope

    Q: Will minions kills counts toward the quests in sabotage?
    A: Yes
    Post edited by TimeMaster on
  • Please forgive me, as I'm going to be blunt and maybe a little unkind.

    Why are you reintroducing a PvP mode to OMD:U? I'll happily grant you that Sabotage has several things going for it that Siege never did, but it still shares a lot of the same issues. Primarily, it feels like a complete reverse in design direction. The giant blog post that announced the removal of Siege until recently was prominently featured on the community page, and contained the following statements. Yes, I'm picking things that support my argument.
    • "When we look at the big picture from players alongside the server data, a clear picture starts to emerge– Survival is by far the most popular element of OMDU."
    • "As the game has grown, Siege and Survival modes have competed with one another more and more for development resources. The need to balance the traps, heroes, and gear for both of these game modes and develop each in consideration with the other is holding both modes back."
    • "The most common piece of community feedback we get is that the game still needs to feel more like OMD and OMD2. We've always agreed with that feedback. Adding Survival and Endless modes to OMDU was a big step in that direction, and we can make them much, much better. The vast majority of our beta players came looking for that classic Orcs Must Die! feeling, and we can and will deliver it."
    • "Our focus will now turn entirely toward making Survival feel, look, sound, and play more like a clear evolution of OMD and OMD2. We're doubling down on Survival mode to bring back the kick-orc OMD gameplay you love."
    To be fair, in that same blog post is also the following quote.
    "We believe that competitive gameplay still has a future in Orcs Must Die!, but we've decided that Siege mode is just not the right fit for that. Competitive gameplay could return to OMDU, and if it does, it won't be in the form of Siege."

    All that said, the introduction of Sabotage just leaves me confused. Patch after patch was coming down the pipe focusing on and supporting the PvE game. Survival was getting better just as fast as old Siege remnants were being addressed. And now an announcement that a competitive game mode that has never seen public beta testing will go live on the same day as the game's official release? I do not envy your QA teams or your support staff in the coming weeks.

    I hope for the best, but I expect the worst.
  • edited April 7
    - Sabotage will reward specifically sabotage cards?

    - If new trap, guardians or gears are added in the future how players that played every hero and maps are gonna be able to get those stuff, by playing sabotage?

    -About the minions and waves...  Are the default minions that comes every wave and the Minions cast by the players just blend into them or All Minions that come each wave are minions cast?

    -How is a commercial release is gonna affect the game? By that I is gonna be different with the end of Beta and the beginning of the commercial release?
    Post edited by SenatorBird on
  • 1:New Achievemants with Sabotage?
    2: Can I start updating stuff on my website towards fixed values and informations from game? Or each next patch will continue in changing whole game mechanics, balancing, values and timing of everything?
    Other words: How much changes we can expect in future patches?
    First and only CZ&SK funsite of OMD series http://orcs-must-die.cz

  • edited April 7
    @SenatorBird @apin

    Half of your questions were replied above. Sabotage will reward sabotage consumable chests (WIN/LOSE) but there will be sabotage achievements and sabotage quests that will give regular chests too.

    Q: Are Sabotage consumables unlimited?
    A: Not all. There are some that are the "basic" like starter ones, that have unlimited uses. Others that are acquired can be used once per card obtained.

    Q: About the minions and waves...  Are the default minions that comes every wave and the Minions cast by the players just blend into them or All Minions that come each wave are minions cast?
    A: They just "blend", they are addition to the waves.

    Q: Can I start updating stuff on my website towards fixed values and informations from game? Or each next patch will continue in changing whole game mechanics, balancing, values and timing of everything?
    A: Release doesn't mean that changes or patches are gonna stop, balance will be a constant change. However I would expect no big overhauls or total system changes, so I would and I will go for content creation from now on with a quite safe bet.
  • edited April 7
    @TimeMaster

    Do you knows if we are able to choose from which gates the minions we cast are gonna come from or if it is random in maps that have more than one gate?

    Btw about the first question I meant "Only" sabotage reward after playing sabotage matches, by that I mean no trap cards then?
  • edited April 7

    All that said, the introduction of Sabotage just leaves me confused. Patch after patch was coming down the pipe focusing on and supporting the PvE game. Survival was getting better just as fast as old Siege remnants were being addressed. And now an announcement that a competitive game mode that has never seen public beta testing will go live on the same day as the game's official release? I do not envy your QA teams or your support staff in the coming weeks.

    I hope for the best, but I expect the worst.
    I have a feeling...(maybe I should remove my tinfoil hat)... that they are rushing the thing to meet a deadline. Drop of old PvP, closure of European Servers(even if it brings higher combined population), now this instant reveal...

    The game is desperately trying to get somewhere, and for many games "somewhere"  - is a release stage. Just as there are many enthusiasts, who couldn't care less if it's Alpha or Release(not that there is a big difference in the modern games, lol), there are those, who just have learned the hard way not to bother with Beta.

    Pushing the game to release, as well as adding a sort of PvP - is a quick and radical way to both bring back the extremely butthurt PvP comminity, and to bring the community that prefers "finished" games.

    How will it turn out? Indeed, let's be ready for the worst. Of course, ultimately there is no real harm. I can ignore 50XP daily, and I still have tons of grinding to do in Survival. The only thing I, as a PvE player, can expect to harm me - is the delay of necessary QoL updates to Survival, which is in Open Beta state.
    While Premium Shoppe is a good thing, it doesn't quite push Survival out of Open Beta. It's more of an endgame plug for some issues that should be instead resolved by taming the korean RNG, not adding more korean RNG.
  • Please forgive me, as I'm going to be blunt and maybe a little unkind.

    Why are you reintroducing a PvP mode to OMD:U? I'll happily grant you that Sabotage has several things going for it that Siege never did, but it still shares a lot of the same issues. Primarily, it feels like a complete reverse in design direction. The giant blog post that announced the removal of Siege until recently was prominently featured on the community page, and contained the following statements. Yes, I'm picking things that support my argument.
    • "When we look at the big picture from players alongside the server data, a clear picture starts to emerge– Survival is by far the most popular element of OMDU."
    • "As the game has grown, Siege and Survival modes have competed with one another more and more for development resources. The need to balance the traps, heroes, and gear for both of these game modes and develop each in consideration with the other is holding both modes back."
    • "The most common piece of community feedback we get is that the game still needs to feel more like OMD and OMD2. We've always agreed with that feedback. Adding Survival and Endless modes to OMDU was a big step in that direction, and we can make them much, much better. The vast majority of our beta players came looking for that classic Orcs Must Die! feeling, and we can and will deliver it."
    • "Our focus will now turn entirely toward making Survival feel, look, sound, and play more like a clear evolution of OMD and OMD2. We're doubling down on Survival mode to bring back the kick-orc OMD gameplay you love."
    To be fair, in that same blog post is also the following quote.
    "We believe that competitive gameplay still has a future in Orcs Must Die!, but we've decided that Siege mode is just not the right fit for that. Competitive gameplay could return to OMDU, and if it does, it won't be in the form of Siege."

    All that said, the introduction of Sabotage just leaves me confused. Patch after patch was coming down the pipe focusing on and supporting the PvE game. Survival was getting better just as fast as old Siege remnants were being addressed. And now an announcement that a competitive game mode that has never seen public beta testing will go live on the same day as the game's official release? I do not envy your QA teams or your support staff in the coming weeks.

    I hope for the best, but I expect the worst.
    Just to help clear up a bit:
    • This was siege vs. survival numbers. I'm pretty sure alot of those numbers were due to the complex nature of siege, but I think sabotage is supposed to be more lax. Basically it's survival with the consumables.
    • This was true, but you need to look at it like this: In siege some heroes were offensive. That made them bad at defense (killing minions). In sabotage, you don't have that issue. You're still balancing everything for killing minions.
    • I'd argue that they've accomplished this.
    • I'd also argue this was done, so they redirected some resources to sabotage.

    Mind you, I'm concerned that this hasn't been tested for launch either, but I'm also super excited.
    Wiki Contributor: Juicearific - Got a wiki suggestion? Let me know.
    Welcome to Juicy's Midnight Assassination Service. You grab em, I'll stab em.
  • it was a mistake to try to include both siege and survival in the same game. OMDU should be about siege only, and separate survival to OMD3

    even if you have to include both modes in the same game for whatever reasons, the simplest solution is to divide parameters (such as HP, damage, cooldown) into siege and survival to be independent of each other.
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