Sabotage

Anyone actually play this mode? Tried it for the first time today and it takes 6 min to find a game....seems like a glorified version of survival, gameplay is almost identical from the match i played 
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Comments

  • XarkiesXarkies Member
    Well I do agree with the part where it's basically the same, just the enemy is the one sending minions and you're doing the same, but for me it takes like 1-2 mins to find a match. Sometimes 3mins but then i Just close the game and start it again and I find it withing 2mins. 
  • LemartesLemartes Member, Early Access, Apprentice Founder
    Last time I tried it que times were 5 to 10 mins.  It was pretty late though.

    I think the lack of trap rewards is killing it.  
  • I've never been into PvP games, so it's understandable I'm not much into Sabotage. I was also never too fond of Siege in its time. But even though I rarely play it, I still think Sabotage is good in its design. The mode suffers from an insufficient player base; I, too, think the lack of substantial reward has a big part to play in this. While playing Sabotage, at the most, you can expect to complete your daily quests, so 2 chests + 500 skulls. That's the max you can earn in a day playing the mode, excluding of course the consumables. But since those are only usable in Sabotage itself...

    To put it simply, you can progress in OMDU by playing only Survival, or only CT, or even by playing only Endless, if you're really into it. Not only is it achievable, it's the "correct" way to unlock stuff and progress in the game. You can't do it by playing Sabotage exclusively. In fact, it's not really doable, since you need trap upgrades for Sabotage, and you cannot realistically earn those by playing Sabotage. You have to play PvE to progress in the game and be able to perform in PvP, but the opposite isn't true. Hell, playing PvP doesn't help you much for playing more PvP. I think it's a problem.
  • edited July 25
    Siege looked pretty fun even though i never got the chance to try it...i do think the entire game should be built around making pve the best it can be though 
  • It's pretty fun once you've played it for a while. The matchmaking used to be horrible but it (seems) to be a lot better now. Queue times will vary depending on when you play.  If they added a rift lord chest reward for every 10 wins or something it would probably increase it's popularity.
  • Siege looked pretty fun even though i never got the chance to try it...i do think the entire game should be built around making pve the best it can be though 
    That's what they tried to do in the days of Siege. It didn't work. The problem is that PvP games are either a success or a failure. There's no place in the market for a mildly successful PvP game, and no garantee for a small studio like Robot that their game will be a hit. Even big AAA publisher have trouble with it; Ubisoft's For Honor has had a very significant drop in players not long after its release, and look at the insane level of marketing they did for the game when it launched. The game wasn't even bad, in fact it was fairly well received. Robot tried it with Siege, wasn't able to make it successful, and reached the conclusion that it wasn't their strong suit. The fact that OMD had always been a PvE franchise didn't help either: OMD players are more interested in a PvE experience, who would have thought? :)

    The current version of the game is PvE focused with some PvP on the side, and I think it's the way to go. But there's a bit of subjectivity there, because I'm mostly a PvE focused player myself.

    It's pretty fun once you've played it for a while. The matchmaking used to be horrible but it (seems) to be a lot better now. Queue times will vary depending on when you play.  If they added a rift lord chest reward for every 10 wins or something it would probably increase it's popularity.
    It should be more than that. A player trying a Survival map for the first time can potentially earn 3 chests in one game. Beyond that, if you don't always use the same character, you can earn a chest every time you finish a game in Survival. It wouldn't be out of place to win a chest at the end of every match of Sabotage. There could be a loser chest with some stuff, and a winner chest with more stuff. And it would be a good source of chests for players who already earned every Survival chest.
  • AxonyAxony Member
    you get looser and winner stuff:
    Winner gets 6 consumables
    Loosers get 3

    What about people who already maxed out their traps? i don't want to be spammed with Gibs
  • Axony said:
    you get looser and winner stuff:
    Winner gets 6 consumables
    Loosers get 3

    What about people who already maxed out their traps? i don't want to be spammed with Gibs
    Consumables can only be used in Sabotage. They can hardly be considered relevant to in-game progress.
    As for the rest of your answer... You make it sound like it's a chore to be awarded stuff. Yes, indeed, rewards are a little useless for people who already own everything, but how is it relevant?
  • I definitely agree about the rewards. As of right now, I only play sabotage because I like the mode itself. While it works for me, there isn't really a lot of encouragement to play sabotage. While some consumables are cool to get and you can't earn them otherwise, they don't replace traps and skulls, both of which I can earn at a much faster rate if I were to grind out apprentice maps with every hero which doesn't seem all that fun to me. I think getting at least something, like a chest every 10 games or so, would be really nice. At the moment, if there is a trap that I want to upgrade, or basically anything I would like to buy with skulls or gibs, I cannot play sabotage to do so, I actually feel forced to not play this mode to progress in the game, which is a shame since I actually like sabotage and would like to be able to progress while playing it.
  • AxonyAxony Member
    At the moment, if there is a trap that I want to upgrade, or basically anything I would like to buy with skulls or gibs, I cannot play sabotage to do so, I actually feel forced to not play this mode to progress in the game, which is a shame since I actually like sabotage and would like to be able to progress while playing it.
    and people felt forced to play sabotage because they got a chest there and only 75XP on Survival games before they changed it.

    I also play a ton of sabotage but like 1 or 2 days a week i feel forced to play Chaos Trials to get some Gibs, a few skulls and maybe a trap that's still missing.
    If you put a chest every 10 games you will have so many people who will just loose wave 1 to get fast chests.

    There are not many Sabotage player (atleast on higher ranking) so they won't change anything if it only affect the smallest part of the playerbase *looking at siege* 
  • I don't like to play sabotage. I have got level 100, now +30 T7 traps, with all heroes, almost all 5starts battlegroudns... and I lose most of half sabotage games because my partners are very bad, fulling the number limit with cheap traps (spike floor, arrow wall and ice shard). It is too hard and fustrating play sabotage to get only a chest what gives more gibbs. 

    For me sabotage is wasting time. Siege was funnier. 
  • I don't like to play sabotage. I have got level 100, now +30 T7 traps, with all heroes, almost all 5starts battlegroudns... and I lose most of half sabotage games because my partners are very bad, fulling the number limit with cheap traps (spike floor, arrow wall and ice shard). It is too hard and fustrating play sabotage to get only a chest what gives more gibbs. 

    For me sabotage is wasting time. Siege was funnier. 
    But if siege was still a thing, wouldn't the results be the same as sabotage results, losing because of teammates, only getting gibs from the chest.
    I like mostly survival and am looking to five star the rest of the RL maps that I need. I don't want to focus CT until those are done.
  • TimeMasterTimeMaster Member, Early Access
    The problem resides on what motivates people to play it.

    I used to play siege because of its competitive nature and the mix of genres. I never played Siege because of the rewards.

    Same happens with Sabotage to me, I started playing it because of the extra challenge and its "competitive" nature too, it has never been about the rewards. However with a mainly PvE game, that idea changes, most players are here for the PvE which is usually about rewards and progression, which made most people play it just for the quest of the chest, being most of the players playing it uninterested on any kind of competition.

    So players that played it for the extra challenge or competition are gone now since pretty much no one played it with that premise.

    The thing is that if it isn't meant to be about the competitive aspect and most people just played for the rewards, right now there are better rewards on a different mode. So probably only a few people still playing it for the "competition" and some others might truly like it and find it fun, I doubt it will be for long though.
  • AxonyAxony Member
    edited July 27
    Sabotage will get the Siege treatment soon and they will remove it.
    The Queues are getting longer and longer everyday. (around 10min waiting for 1 game)

    I like the competitive aspect and that it reminds me of the good old Warcraft 3 days with a similar concept to Hero Line Wars and Line Tower Wars.
    And only having CT and Survival doesn't keep me entertained for long, CT is kind of boring and i only need it to farm skulls
  • I personally think the biggest problem with Sabotage on PC is that when it is introduced, the player-base is vast, ranging from Noobs to Experts. This caused a major rift to appear between the pre-made and solo-q players. Pre-mades are people of similar levels while Solo-Q gets mix and match of extreme ends. Being "Forced" to play the mode due to the "2 wins quest", a whole bunch of people got annoyed and for some, they're not willing to touch Sabotage again unless they really need to... In simple words, starting out on the wrong foot... It will take time before players go back to Sabotage just for the fun or it.

    I mean, if you just look at the PS4 version of Sabotage, where almost everyone is still Apprentice or Warmage, things are fun. There are no high-levels griping over how those low level traps took up trap limit. There are no low-levels feeling useless because they get KO in one hit by a medium orc. When someone got a "bomb-head" and blows up important barricades, their team-mates laughs, because of the difference between "want to win" and "need to win".

    From what I know, PS4 version don't have pre-mades... so that's whole bunch of problems avoided...
  • AxonyAxony Member
    they can't complain on PS4 because they have no chat option.
    I saw a few PS4 stream where people were raging over their teammates but they have no way to tell them so it seems like nothing bad happened ingame. You can't even use pings like "Place barricade here".
    Just play a game without pings and without using chat on PC and it will look like you don't mind the random Hogarth blowing up 3 cades and loosing you the game.

    PC really has a giant gap between low ranks and high ranks, i personally play solo and duoqueue and the matchmaker always gives up and matches me with "low level" or "low ranked" players.

    There are not enough players when the matchmaker tells me that the estimated time to find a match is ~3min and it needs 10-15min to actually find a match.
  • SliqSliq Member
    I used to play sabotage all the time, mainly for the daily reward chest, but over time the queue times have gradually increased and it gets tedious waiting.  This combined with the fact that ppl often bail out at the selection screen means further re-queueing.  Compounded with the fact that ppl tend to go afk or d/c from the start of the match means I'm often playing a 2 vs 3 fight which isn't good at all!

    Recently I've noticed the latest meta is bringing coin generators and flip/spring traps to farm each wave, where you end up waiting around for an additional few minutes each wave for the opponents to finish farming the the wave.  It brings on a whole new level of tedium, and effectively doubles the match time.

    For me, it simply isn't worth the effort anymore.  I'm not that interested in it anymore, the rewards are laughable and the time to reward ratio is simply absurd.

    I prefer to just play survival now, less stressful and much quicker turnover.


  • Sliq said:
    I used to play sabotage all the time, mainly for the daily reward chest, but over time the queue times have gradually increased and it gets tedious waiting.  This combined with the fact that ppl often bail out at the selection screen means further re-queueing.  Compounded with the fact that ppl tend to go afk or d/c from the start of the match means I'm often playing a 2 vs 3 fight which isn't good at all!

    Recently I've noticed the latest meta is bringing coin generators and flip/spring traps to farm each wave, where you end up waiting around for an additional few minutes each wave for the opponents to finish farming the the wave.  It brings on a whole new level of tedium, and effectively doubles the match time.

    For me, it simply isn't worth the effort anymore.  I'm not that interested in it anymore, the rewards are laughable and the time to reward ratio is simply absurd.

    I prefer to just play survival now, less stressful and much quicker turnover.


    I'd like to know which rank you are. I'm just curious because the queue times never seemed extremely high for me (like 1-3 minutes most of time, sometimes more sometimes less, I rarely ever have leavers and I never saw anyone on any team dragging the game out to farm extra coin from the generators. Coin generator spam and the usual disagreements, yes, but it wasn't all that terrible for me. Besides, coin generators only reset at the start of a wave so you can't wait for them to reset by pulling a single minion around as far as I know. For reference, my current rank is platinum 4 and I just recently got there, so I was always a lower rank.
  • SliqSliq Member
    I'd like to know which rank you are. I'm just curious because the queue times never seemed extremely high for me (like 1-3 minutes most of time, sometimes more sometimes less, I rarely ever have leavers and I never saw anyone on any team dragging the game out to farm extra coin from the generators. Coin generator spam and the usual disagreements, yes, but it wasn't all that terrible for me. Besides, coin generators only reset at the start of a wave so you can't wait for them to reset by pulling a single minion around as far as I know. For reference, my current rank is platinum 4 and I just recently got there, so I was always a lower rank.
    I'm sitting at gold ii/iii  ...average wait times of 4 minutes
  • I don't know how typical my experience with OMDU is, but I've played to account level 50 or so playing Survival/Endless modes.  Last night I finally played Sabotage for the first time.  First game I didn't really understand WTF was happening.  Didn't help that we got the Restricted Area map.  We got wrecked hard and fast.  OK then.  I'm a relatively fast learner.  This game mode goes quick.  I played 6 more matches and won every one of them.  I was playing with my son and we were laughing our heads off at the pings when the enemy team would get overrun after we played our cards.

    I agree with the general sentiment that the game mode rewards could maybe give a single trap card to a player on the winning team or something to make it a comparable use of time for leveling vs. PVE, but what I would really like to see is a "kill cam" where I could watch what the heck happened to the other team when they got overrun (watch the entire last wave for example).  Even a simple overview like with the minimap (where you select where to put certain sabotages) or something.
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